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RE: [OM] Re: Medium Format vs. Digital

Subject: RE: [OM] Re: Medium Format vs. Digital
From: "George M. Anderson" <george@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 14:59:39 -0800
>
> >From: "George M. Anderson" <george@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
> [good points clipped... glad to see we're being reasonable over
> religious... :-]

****************
Me too, Jan. Still enjoying that little zoom you bought from me I hope! :>)
****************

>
> >But don't discount the time and effort to get the image right in PShop.
> >test prints are, at best, a 2-day turnaround...
> >worlds of trouble
> >getting 'right' in the computer domain...
> >**profile** problems making some saturated yellows
> >appear GREEN...
> >**out-of-gamut** problems...
>
> Darkroom work can be equally frustrating if you are just starting
> out. Repeatable results? That depends on controlling temperature
> to within 0.2 degree, and making sure your chemicals and paper
> are at a particular point in their lifetime! And lets not forget
> the stabilized power supply, lest some line sag change the light
> output of your enlarger...

****************
Excellent points of course.  These devils catch me often.
****************

>
 schooled and experienced in digital arts say the same
> thing about "profiles" and "gamuts."

****************

Maybe. I'm still not terribly experienced in the dgital side.  However, as
an example, I recently worked for months to fill an order for a 30x40 print
which drove me digitally-nuts.  (I can make a fine 20x24 Ciba of it, but
nothing larger).  The profile my lab is using, one by a certain famous Apple
retiree, converted some yellows to green. (Thus my previous question as to
have you ever seen a green sunset.) They said - oh yeah, we're aware of
this. 'B' says he'll do a new profile as soon as he gets time. Right now,
he's off on a trip and he has a class to teach when he returns and ...  Wow,
that helps!

Now the lab did work with me and we found a 6 month old profile that didn't
have the problem quite as severely. Then I worked real hard in PShop using
Selective Color and other layers along with view custom proof setup to get
the green down to as little as possible.  Never could quite get rid of it.
The final print, which looked fabulous (albeit a tiny bit green where it
should have been yellow), had been ordered on July 28, and finally delivered
in November.  Thank God for a patient customer, eh?

BTW, they're still using the same profile.  Another trip must've come up!
:>)
****************

>
> Of course, the broad range of options and prices don't help much.
> I have a scanning client who insists on doing her own printing on
> a $200 printer, vs my $18,000 one. She uses some bargain-basement
> paint program that doesn't allow Photoshop-style grayscale
> masking. She uses the cheapest photo paper Costco sells.
>
> She proudly brought me some prints to look at that were, shall we
> say, much less than perfect. She wanted to know which of them she
> should submit to the Portland Art Museum's annual juried open
> show. I diplomatically suggested that since there will be over
> 1,000 applicants for 100 spots, she shouldn't be too disappointed
> if she doesn't get in.
>
> >All this said, I'd still put up a well-printed Cibachrome against a good
> >Ink-jet of the *same* image and expect the Ciba to have more depth, color
> >and 'look' to it.
>
> If there was some money behind this, I might take you up on it!

****************
Can I choose the image? :>)
****************

>
> As one who does digital work that experienced photographers can't
> tell are digital, the biggest problem I have is public
> perception. People (like George!) have this impression that
> digital output is both inferior, and somehow easier than
> photochemical output. I just push a button and it comes out, right? WRONG!

****************
I think I said something unlike this in some of my message you filtered out.
I use digital prints myself, for the 2 reasons I stated before. They are
beautiful, or I couldn't sell them.
****************

>
> I once had someone come up to one of my large prints, scrutinize
> it closely, and ask, "Is this a photographic print?"

Ha!  It's funny, when I'm selling in my art show booth, many, many people
who wander thru say something like - "these colors don't look real. Are you
doing this in Photoshop?"  :>) BTW, the colors DO look real, actually really
real!,  people are just used to seeing photo prints from Long's drugs etc
without contrast or deep color ... just not used to seeing genuine CPS
polyester/P3 Cibachrome prints.  They DO look better.

George


>


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