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Re: [OM] Forest carp

Subject: Re: [OM] Forest carp
From: Jan Steinman <Jan@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 11:17:40 -0800
> From: Dean Hansen <unafr112@xxxxxxxxxx>
>
> I don't mind sounding
> heartless--40-50 deer per square mile of forest have an absolutely
> devastating effect on pine and oak regeneration...
> Dean (who's definitely NOT a PETA member)

If we're really talking "ethical treatment of animals" here, then I  
think culling is the proper thing to do. Or better yet, bring back the  
top predators!

In Yellowstone, streams and riparian areas were in trouble. Banks were  
eroding, causing excessive silt, causing loss of fish habitat, causing  
reductions in eagles and osprey. No one really knew why.

Then, quite independently and for entirely different reasons, wolves  
were re-introduced. The stream health mysteriously improved, and fish  
increased, as did fish-eating predators and scavengers.

The key was that the ungulates (moose, deer, elk) had been standing  
around in one place without fear, eating new streamside vegetation to  
the ground, not giving it a chance to re-grow. Once the wolves were re- 
introduced, the ungulates became wary, and kept moving around, and  
streamside vegetation (especially willows and other quick-growing,  
water-loving perennials) came back.

The lovely thing about this is that it eventually becomes better for  
the ungulates, as well. A dense streamside thicket is a much safer  
from predators than an eroded, cleared bank.

A similar situation exists in the Olympics, and ecologists want to re- 
introduce wolves there, but local opposition is strong.

This has been a hard winter here. There was deep snow cover for longer  
than deer can live without food. I counted six starved deer in less  
than a quarter square kilometre. We'd find them in the brush and drag  
them out into the fields for the eagles, who had a feast. (Requisite  
on-topic info: no, didn't get any pictures of the eagles.)

Dean, you can come over here and shoot all the deer you want. Although  
I'm a vegetarian, I'd rather feed the deer to the eagles, who will  
then leave our chickens alone. It's more ethical to cull the heard  
than to let them die of starvation.

We meddle in natural systems at our own peril.

:::: Look at the suite of technologies used by a person or a culture,  
and it’s an easy matter to divine the values that person or that  
culture holds and the goals they pursue. This is unmentionable in our  
culture, because the values and goals our technologies reveal to the  
world are a very long ways indeed from the ones we claim to embrace.  
-- John Michael Greer ::::
:::: Jan Steinman, EcoReality http://www.EcoReality.org ::::



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